Open Seat: A Holy Family Podcast

Encounters with the Spirit

• Holy Family Adrian • Season 1 • Episode 13

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In this episode of Open Seat, Joe Baker shares his transformative experiences with the Holy Spirit throughout his life. From unexpected job opportunities to profound personal realizations, Joe reveals how faith and spiritual encounters have guided him. He discusses significant milestones, including his time in the army, his involvement in the Charismatic Renewal, and meeting his wife Pat. Joe's stories provide insight into how he came to love himself and others, emphasizing the importance of making an impact in one's own corner of the world. Tune in for an inspiring conversation about faith, forgiveness, and personal growth.

This is a podcast of Holy Family Parish, located in Adrian MI. We are a Catholic people, not a place, striving to Live Jesus through celebrating the sacraments and forming disciples in Adrian and beyond.

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Open Seat es un podcast Parroquia de la Sagrada Familia ubicada en Adrian, Michigan. Somos un pueblo católico, no un lugar, que se esfuerza por vivir a Jesús celebrando los sacramentos y formando discípulos en Adrian y más allá.

Joe:

Don't ever let yourself get overwhelmed with, how could one little person, you know, make an impact? Well, you make one impact on one person, and, you've made the world a better place. Welcome to Open Seat, the podcast where we create a space for authentic conversations about faith, unfiltered and unapologetic. Here, we believe that every story matters. Whether you're questioning, seeking, or steadfast in your beliefs, you'll find something relatable in these heartfelt discussions. So grab your seat, get comfortable, and let's dive into today's story here at Open Seat. so today on the Open Seat, we have Joe Baker with us. Thank you for joining us, Joe. Nice to be here.

Katie:

How, how are things going for you?

Joe:

Life is good.

Katie:

So, let's talk about Joe. What do you want to tell us today, Joe?

Joe:

I thought I would give some highlights of my life via the Spirit, the Holy Spirit, encounters with the Spirit. And I'm sure that they started before I realized that they were happening. I'm sure of that because as I reflect back on things that happened in my life, I think, that wasn't just a coincidence. And it certainly wasn't because of anything I did or earned or deserved. But good things have come my way. I remember being in my backyard one time. This was after I, graduated undergrad about two weeks before the beginning of the school year, and I got a call from somebody I went to college with and she said, you got a job yet? And I said, no. And then she said, well, they're needing another religion teacher at Divine Child High School. Would you be interested? I don't know. I'm not a teacher. I didn't take any education classes, but what's the class? And she said, well, they need somebody to teach all of their marriage and family living class to their seniors. And I say, well, that sounds like God calling. I didn't say that, but now I realize it. And so I took that job anyway. So that was just one of many instances that would have been a long time ago. I forget what year. So I want to go back to the fall of '68. That would have been my freshman year in high school. So I had gone to a Catholic school, K through 8. And then the Catholic school in my hometown of Perry, Iowa, closed a few years before that. And so I had to go to the public school. Well, in our Catholic school, there was about 26 of us, I think, that graduated from the 8th grade. And we were, I suppose, typical kids. Just because we were at a Catholic school doesn't mean that we were all that Christian. We had these things called slam books. So it was a spiral notebook and you put down somebody's name on the top of each page. Then you passed it around and you put your initials on it and you made some comment about that person.

Katie:

I think I've seen something like this in Disney movies.

Joe:

Was it an old one?

Katie:

Yeah. Well, relative.

Joe:

This was back in '67. It would have been at any rate. So the kids that were popular, of course, people said nice things about them, and the kids that weren't, we said nasty things about them. And I don't want to mention any names, but I was certainly one that was joining the group and saying nasty things about a few girls and a few boys. One of the girls, I'm gonna say her name, Christine Moll. As I recall, she wasn't a good student. She was really quiet, but she was, I guess we thought she was homely. So when I went to the high school the next year, I walk in one direction and Christine is walking another direction with somebody I don't know. I'm glad she found a friend, and I pretended like I didn't see her. So I'm kind of looking the other way and looking down or whatever. And well, guess what? My spiral notebook was sticking out a little too far and a wire at the bottom of it got hooked on her sweater. Oh, so it was like this forced encounter. It's like, Oh, hi, Christine. I didn't see ya. And I felt really bad. I felt really bad. And when I tell that story, when I think of that story I think of what I saw when I looked at her. And I saw a beautiful face. She was very peaceful and quiet and wouldn't hurt a flea. Which made me feel even worse. And so I think that was a calling that, you need to straighten up your act and treat people right. And So, that I think was, a connection for us by the Spirit.

Katie:

Yeah, I, I think that still occurs today, right? Maybe not with the books, but just in how we treat people in general.

Joe:

Yeah, and sometimes we need to get whacked. I think

Katie:

Is what A god two by four, huh?

Joe:

Yeah, something like that. Okay, so then I'll skip ahead to the fall of 74. I was in the army. I was a chaplain's assistant because I didn't want to bear arms I was working in the at Fort Ben Harrison. It was unlike other military bases. We had a lot of retired personnel in the area. And so they had enough Catholic people that came to, Mass there on a weekend that they at some point they dedicated one chapel to be just the catholic chapel.

Katie:

Oh, yeah That's very unusual

Joe:

very unusual. Yep. And so I was working in the protestant chapel the base chapel. I had a little more aptitude than the average G.I., I suppose. And they appointed me funds clerk. So I was taking care of the money from them that the chapel took in as offerings and paying bills and so forth So I'm up in the balcony of the post chapel, which was used by all different Protestant denominations, and the Catholic chaplain walks in, he's got this bellowing voice, and he says, Private Baker! Yes, chaplain, I understand you're Catholic. Yes, chaplain, but you're going to work for me. So, I was Yanked out of

Katie:

the protestant world and Back into

Joe:

the Catholic and I took my books with me. I was still funds clerk but chaplain Bykowski he was a diocesan priest from Chicago. It was a big Polish guy Norbert by Kowski a bellowing voice great sense of humor great homilist, very gregarious personality. We shared the same birthday.

Katie:

Oh, well that's essential.

Joe:

That, well, it was coincidental.[laughter] but he, allowed me the room to question the faith that I had drifted away from. And, I had, a couple of years before that, gotten married at a young age for the wrong reasons and he helped me through the annulment process and, answered my questions about the Catholic Church that I quit asking because I didn't like the answers I was getting. And so he was very much an instrumental, part of my faith development.

Katie:

I'm assuming he's passed away at this point.

Joe:

He has, five years ago or so.

Katie:

But did you keep in touch long after?

Joe:

We did, absolutely. Every year, Christmas cards. He was a major when I knew him and he retired as a full colonel. And then, was still doing, weekend duty in, around Chicago area. Mm hmm. Loved the men. Ha, ha, ha. That was in the fall of '74. So I stayed with the church. when I'd go home on the weekends, my mom and dad were involved in the charismatic renewal. Oh yes. And I started tipped my toes in those waters. And

Katie:

It was really popular in the eighties, right?

Joe:

Yeah. Seventies and eighties. Yeah. Seventies and eighties. That, deepened my faith life in a way that strictly Catholic didn't provide, more encounters with the spirit. In the fall of 77, I got out of the service in the spring of '77. In the fall of '77, I met Pat.

Katie:

Oh, your lovely wife today.

Joe:

My lovely wife today. And, that was Holy Spirit. Certainly. I was dating a couple of different young ladies and wasn't really going anywhere. And my sister, I have five sisters, but the one sister that is the quietest among them, she kept telling me, there's this girl at work and she's really nice. I think you'd like her. And that was the extent of her sails.

Katie:

That was a good pitch, wasn't it? Were you thinking it was Christine coming back to?

Joe:

Shame on you. It was a good one though. Again, it was more than I deserved. Pat was more than I deserved. And so the rest is history as far as that goes.

Katie:

Yes. Well, history in terms of, you know, three sons and a, and a wife of how many years later? Yeah.

Joe:

a number that's over 40, 45.

Katie:

That's good.

Joe:

45 years. And, it's been a great life. It's getting better every year. spring of '78. Okay, so I I was just finishing up my first year of college after getting out of the service. And I didn't know what I was going to do during the summer. And my brother in law had his own concrete business and he was telling me I had to start my own painting business because I was, I had done a lot of painting. And I kind of, yeah, whatever. I didn't see myself as a business owner. I didn't have, well, Anything that required, including a car or a truck.

Katie:

Well, you were, you were also a social worker graduate, right?

Joe:

No, this was undergrad

Katie:

still. Oh, undergrad, okay.

Joe:

So, I had done some painting for a lady a friend of my mom's during the school year not getting paid, with the understanding that once she sold the house, then I would get paid. So I'm at school, toward the end of the school year. I usually, I was walking distance from home. I was living with my parents. I would usually just go to class and then walk home. But this day, for whatever reason, I hung out in the Roost, little coffee shop, with a couple of friends and before I went home, I needed to use the bathroom. So I went into a bathroom that I had never been into before. And on the wall there was a 3x5 postcard and it said a 1971 Ford Ranch Wagon, Station Wagon, was for sale for $450. Interesting. I washed my hands and I went home. When I got home, I found out that the lady had stopped by with a check for %500.

Katie:

Oh, that's quite a bit of money.

Joe:

Well, yeah, then it was. It was enough to buy a car.

Katie:

Yeah.

Joe:

And get the plates transferred.

Katie:

I was gonna say, maybe a little gas too.

Joe:

Well, it had some gas in it. It got me started. So that was the beginning of Joe's painting and home repair. So I followed his advice and I kept that business going right through the rest of undergrad and grad school. And it worked quite well to supplement Pat's income while I was going to school on the GI Bill. That story I have used several times as my testimony for belief in the Holy Spirit.

Katie:

Oh, the, the painting business story.

Joe:

Yeah. The little postcard on the wall there that it just, it was there for me, you know, at just the right time. Never been in that bathroom before. The check came that day. I mean everything lined up. I didn't cause that to happen.

Katie:

Well, right. Cause you, I mean, you didn't even know how much you were going to get paid from the woman for painting.

Joe:

No, I didn't.

Katie:

So when it just came, yeah. Perfect. Everything just works out well, and I'm sure Pat was probably relieved because then you could help supplement the income a little bit.

Joe:

Well, that was before we were married.

Katie:

Okay. Well, you could take her out on some dates.

Joe:

On something other than my unemployment check. I'm just kidding. Shh. Don't tell. Shouldn't have been getting that, but I did. around that time, I had an experience at a charismatic prayer meeting that really changed my life. Right prior to this experience, during a break, of a class that I was taking at the University of Detroit on St. Augustine. Father John O'Malley was the instructor. It was a very good class. We happen to be in the bathroom together.

Katie:

Do you just hang out in bathrooms, Gerald? These stories are all involving one central location.

Joe:

Well, we take care of needs as they arise.[Laughter] And, I don't know exactly the words he used, but he said, he asked me if I was okay, and I said, yeah. And he said, you don't look okay. And he said something about, you have this sad, hurt look on your face. I said, I think I'm just somber and serious. And so he left and I was looking in the mirror and it looks like I've looked for a long time. When I'm looking in the mirror, I don't think I'm hurting for anything in particular. so not too long after that, I was at this prayer meeting and we were going around and people were sharing things, whatever, that they wanted prayer for or and at some point, it occurred to me that I was very happy with who I was at the moment. That I felt really good about myself. And the next thought was, everything that's happened to me prior to this brought me to where I am today. So I'm gonna just accept it all. The good, the bad, the ugly, the good things I did, the bad things I did, the bad choices. people I've hurt, Christine Moll. And I was just, I felt freed. I probably teared up, I'm sure I did. Thank you mom, for the gift of tears. Laughter And, so then I was in a position to get married. I had, I was able to love myself and now I could really love Pat.

Katie:

So do you share that story with the marriage prep? Cause you're doing marriage prep now. So do you share with them that they have to love themselves before they can?

Joe:

Well, maybe I will today. Yeah. As a matter of fact.

Katie:

Cause I think that's a really important thing that not a lot of people would realize. And that's a beautiful statement, what you just made there. I can't love another person unless I love myself.

Joe:

I've preached that before. And, and I haven't, haven't always realized when it became true for me.

Katie:

and, you know, that's I think the second part of the greatest commandment, right? Love your God with all your heart, your soul, your might. Everybody gets that part. But love your neighbor as yourself? Well, if I don't love myself, then I cannot love somebody else. I think you really should share that with those marriage prep couples, because I think it's important.

Joe:

The other part of loving Pat, I put together just recently, I was preparing for an RCIA class, and I read that prayer is just conversation with God. And I was kind of bothered by that when I started to think about, most of my prayer is either a prayer of thanksgiving, a prayer of adoration, or a prayer of petition, asking for something. There's no conversation. I just sit down and I start praying. And then it, somehow, I got whacked and he said, you know what? God started the conversation when he put those things in my life that I'm thankful for. When he gave me the gift of faith that enables me to pray and to ask and to believe. And so I'm thinking on that and I remember back to a time when Pat and I were still dating. I'm not sure we were even engaged at that point. And she saw me in I was in pretty rough shape, from alcohol. And, and she loved me anyway. She just hugged me so tight and, and, I think there was some more tears. And so, yeah, that's something I do share. Not the events, but the idea that we love because we were loved first. And that's the conversation with God. He started it.

Katie:

He did start it. He's probably gonna finish it too, but I'm just gonna

Joe:

He's gonna get the last word?

Katie:

Wouldn't argue that one, buddy. You might lose. That's a very good thought though, too. He first loved us so we can love. And the idea of prayer just continuing as a continual conversation, I always think about that Philippians, where it says, pray without ceasing. And I'm like, man, I don't have time to pray without ceasing. Are you kidding me? My boss keeps me really busy, like it can't happen. But it's just the continual idea of the conversation never ceasing. This with God.

Joe:

Yeah. Being aware that he's aware.

Katie:

That's it .Actually, to remind me of that, my boss though, kindly put a candle on my desk. I hate the smell of the Yankee candles that flow so freely through this office area, but, for Lent, he gave me the penance to put one of those lovely smelling things on my desk And it is really good because it reminds me not only when that scent is triggering my nose But also just the flicker of the candle that I am always in God's presence so it just never ends God always gets the last word even though I put it out at night

Joe:

I thought of something else I wanted to share, and that was the best advice I ever got. From Chaplain Bykowski. One of the things that I was struggling with was the evil in the world. There was so much evil in the world, all over the world, and how could I fix it, you know? or in some conversation was, What he figured out for himself was he couldn't, but what he could do was whatever he could do in his little corner of the world. And that is what I, took from that, and have tried to do since then, is when opportunities arise for me to do some good, to help, to be involved with something that is trying to help other people to not say no to that. And to this day I don't spend a lot of time worrying about the rest of the world, in this country or any other country in the planet. what does matter is what you do with where you're planted.

Katie:

Blooming where we're planted, right? Francis DeSales. you know, Joe, honestly, I think you're retired. Although your litany of jobs currently in your corner of the planet is pretty long.

Joe:

I keep busy.

Katie:

That's an understatement. With the food pantry, the marriage prep, RCIA, I don't even know what else. But I know those three things. And you're a main component of those three things. So it's not just a little bit of time, but, but quite a bit that you put in. But I think that's really good advice for people who are struggling right now because there are a lot of people who are struggling right now with things that are happening in the world. So maybe people will start helping in their little areas and beautifying communities, Groundwork effort.

Joe:

Yeah, don't ever let yourself get overwhelmed with, how could one little person, you know, make an impact? Well, you make one impact on one person, and, you've made the world a better place. That is so true.

Katie:

That is very, very true. I just have one question because you've been talking about the Charismatic Renewal. So, do you think that that has been instrumental in helping you find the Holy Spirit in your life? Because I think that's, the Holy Spirit's an underutilized resource that we have in our faith. But do you think the Charismatic Renewal really woke you up to seeing the Holy Spirit?

Joe:

Yes, definitely in the Renewal, in the Charismatic Renewal, the Holy Spirit was a big player. And not that the Holy Spirit isn't active anyway But like you say to recognize and to seek out and to give credit to

Katie:

that's it. I mean the gifts and the fruits of the Spirit I think could help us with a lot of things in this world and our individual Lives it's just not recognized.

Joe:

Yes

Katie:

And you you did a Cursillo right? So did that help strengthen some of that?

Joe:

Maybe. It was a million years ago. It was a long time ago. And I think I was probably already living some of it, a lot of it. It didn't have the impact on me that it has had on, heard that it has had on a lot of people. It wasn't a bad thing. But it It's long.

Katie:

Well, it is four days, yes. Not, not often are you requested to give a four day weekend.

Joe:

Well, and then just to listen to other people. That's, that's a lot of listening. And I am a good listener, and that's why I chose the profession that I did. And so, When I'm done listening, I'm tired. Because it's work.

Katie:

This is true. This is very true. Yes, that's why I say I go home alone and I don't even use my phone generally when I go home after a day's work. Because you're right. It is, it's intense stuff. Well, Joe, I cannot thank you enough for sharing your wisdom with the Holy Spirit with us today. I know. the Holy Spirit is still very much alive in your life. It didn't end in the 80s and before but it continues.

Joe:

Oh, yes

Katie:

continue to be visible and Thank you for sharing your wisdom freely with RCIA and marriage prep and all of us today because you have a lot to give

Joe:

It's a privilege and an honor

Katie:

Once again, we thank you for joining us today. We hope that wherever you find an open seat in your life, you will invite someone to join you.

People on this episode

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Katie Love

Host
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Joe Baker

Guest